February 2000 Selected Articles

Let’s me start by saying what a fine location we had for our January meeting at Dave and Sherri Brown’s. Dave has just completed an addition to their pond and it looks great. As an added bonus, they have a nature trail leading to some spectacular wetlands. We raffled four fish that were given to our club by a couple in Eagle Harbor in Orange Park. The fish grew too big for their pond and they were so glad we could find their "babies" a good home. Our first meeting for the year 2000 went well and a big thank you to Dave and Sherri for welcoming us into your home.

Speaking of opening your homes, we sure would benefit if more members would be willing to have a meeting at their home this year. We all know that the first time is the hardest, and people are hesitant to put their pond on display. But, as you can see, we’re a very informal group and even "under construction" ponds are OK with us! Don’t be shy, get with Charlie for hosting a meeting. We’d love to see your pond.

The All Florida Show is March 17-19 this year, again at Splendid China. If you plan on attending, and would like to volunteer, please let us know. This show is an excellent chance to make contact with many koi dealers as well fish food and pond supply vendors.

At our February meeting, Koi Mom, Sandee Todorsky will be selling fish and Rod Lawton will have food and some other koi products for sale.

Have you noticed the new feature in our newsletter, Koi Chat By Sandee Todorsky? Each month her article will highlight a different club member. This adds a personal touch to our newsletter and will be fun to read.

Hope to see you at the February meeting. Jim Roberts.

Office of the Secretary by: Anne

What a beautiful day we had for our first meeting of the year 2000. Sunshine and warm weather competed with the lovely yard and new pond of our hosts, Dave and Sherri Brown. We had 39 people brave the flu and cold bugs to attend.

Jim opened the meeting by asking for volunteers to host meetings for this year, there are still several months open, please let someone on the board know if you are interested. Four Koi were raffled at the meeting as well as some door prizes.

Rod Lawton told us about the latest AFKAPS meeting. The judges for the show in Orlando have been picked, with Lester Berkow, MD as head judge. Looks like it will be a great show or day trip for those not wanting to show. The raffles to be held at the show were discussed. " Koi by Karin", one of the vendors, has donated a $500.00 fish to be raffled, the name of whoever wins the fish (K108 on the web site) will be entered into a drawing for a trip to Japan. Daytime raffles will consist of several prizes worth at least $100.00, plus the grand prize; you must be present to win. This year there will be limit of 34 show tanks at the show, all will be soft side tanks, and some have already be reserved. You may bring our own tank, but it will be counted as one of the 34, with a set up fee of $20.00. Tanks will be $30.00 for a 4 ft, $40.00 for a 6 and $50.00 for an 8. If you are interested in showing you will need to get your reservation in quickly. Rod will have AFKAP pins available for $5.00 if you contact him before our next meeting. Also Ron has information on the round show tubs, the price is below wholesale, if purchased together. The 19 1/2-gal 22" bowl is $22.00, the 23 gal 27" is $28.50, and the heavy-duty 23 gal is $35.00. Locally these bowls sell for $33 to $56.00. Now will be a good time to buy one while the price is low. AFKAPS and most future shows will be English style, therefore each tank must have it’s own net and show tub.

Koi Chat with Sandee

Pat & JoAnne Rutherford have been NFKC members for approximately three years. Like many of us, they joined on the Pond Tour. But it was JoAnne’s interest that was first sparked when she read an article about the Wally’s pond in Mandarin.

The Rutherfords started small. Their first pond was a 25-gallon prefab that they set up on their porch. In fact, it won them a prize for the smallest pond at one of our Christmas parties. But that was soon too small. They now have a 2200 gallon above ground pond made of railroad ties covered with stucco. The pond and the seating area are completely covered with shade cloth.

According to Pat they have approximately 20 fish. But he says if you ask JoAnne, she can tell you not only how many fish they have, but where they came from and when they joined the family. They also have a cat and a dog. Their dog just ignores the pond (except to drink out of it). But the highlight of the cat’s day is helping JoAnne feed the fish and snacking on a little fish food as a treat.

Pat brings a special talent to the club. He does a wonderful job of proofreading Barbels. If you find mistakes in an issue it is usually because the articles got in too late for Todo to be able to send the newsletter to Pat before it goes to copy. We would like to thank Pat for his efforts in helping to make Barbels the successful newsletter it has become.

When asked about a fish/pond story, Pat recalls the egret that visited and made a royal feast of 4 fish out of their 25 gallon pond before they could chase him away. The pond was covered with 2 x 2 lattice board. But that didn’t stop the bird’s feast. A few weeks later the bird (or another one like it) revisited. This time Pat caught the bird before it could eat. Since they were on their way to church, they decided to "relocate" the bird. So they took the egret to a drainage pond on S. Blanding. As Pat was unwrapping the towel from the bird’s wings the egret stuck his bill in Pat’s nose and bit down. When they arrived at the church Pat’s nose was bleeding from the inside as well as from the outside. Fortunately no stitches were needed.

Advice for new koi keepers? The Rutherfords suggest that they pay attention at meetings; listen in on the side conversations before and after the meetings; and don’t be afraid to ask.

Ponderings From The Web By Rod Lawton

The following information is actually a discussion that occurred on a web board that I post to. I do not take credit for having said any of the following or it’s accuracy (although I don’t think you will find any fault in it). This format of information is being provided because it is interesting, thought provoking and usually has quite a bit of merit to back it. I hope that by sharing with you, what my friends share with me, I will help further the Koi/Pond keeping knowledge of all who read this and follow on articles I intend write. Not all articles will have a clear answer and may be presented for discussion and thought only. The ultimate decisions or paths you take based on the articles are up ultimately up to you. If nothing else, I will have stimulated you a step deeper into the hobby. Before I present the article, I would like to leave you with a quote from a friend. "In any endeavor, as in all things, there is no one true way." Remember this as you read the articles.

Ammonia Build Up and Acclimation of Bagged fish

Post:  I read xxx's post on acclimating (or lack there of). I've always believed in acclimating, but never really took into account what could be happening with the ammonia if you're introducing water of a pH higher than 7. When I acclimate, over the course of 20-30min, for every two scoops of new water, I remove one of the old. I then take the fish out of the bag and put him in the pond. I was wondering if everybody here shared xxx's views of acclimating. Or other procedures? Thanks-x

Reply:  Several folks have published at national koi meetings the detail of what happens in transport bags. The ammonia shoots up to 10 to 40 PPM, the pH drops to the 5.5 to 6.4 range. The fish live through this nightmare only because the ammonia becomes its non-toxic ammonium chloride form at low pH. When pH rises above 7 by adding pond water to the bag, the ammonia becomes its toxic free ammonia form. This table of how much of the ammonia is in its toxic form has been published many times by a variety of authors, it is straight forward everyday chemical knowledge taught in college chemistry courses. The general effect is that putting pond water in the bag will increase the level of the toxic form of ammonia a factor of 100 or so. If the fish has been in the bag of water long enough to build up high concentrations of ammonia, which does not take long, adding pond water to the bag, then leaving the fish in the bag a while longer, is very likely to kill the fish. A local dealer was killing about half each new koi shipment until I stopped this practice, and she has had no problems since learning to "simply dump the fish into the water", no bag floating, no water exchange. Several folks have also published at national koi meetings that even the practice of floating the bag without water exchange is poor practice. Keeping the fish in that terrible water in the bag for 30 to 60 minutes longer is much worse on the fish than the relatively easy practice of 'just dump them in the water'. Some folks like to lift them out of the water with a net so the water does not go into their pond. I am neutral about this practice, and certainly do not practice it myself. Doing so gives you the possibility of dropping the fish or getting them caught in the net. I simply take the top off the bag and dump the entire contents in the pond. The ammonia and low pH in the water will be diluted sufficiently it is no significant problem. Any nasties such as parasites or bad bacteria will be on the fish anyway, so you are not keeping the nasties out of the pond by not adding the water.   Signed XXX the 'fish, bag, and all dumper'

Reply: This is a second post from the man above who signed as the fish, bag, and all dumper.

My wife the shrink read the post above and said to me, if you are the chemist, post the chemistry to the board. Some of them will understand it, and you will be asked sooner or later to post it anyway. As posted above, the ammonia gets very high in a transport bag, but does not kill the fish because the pH in the bag drops to 5.5 to 6.5.

A table below of the relative amount of ammonia which is in the toxic form versus pH, at a typical temperature of 70F, is'

pH % ammonia in toxic non-ionized form   6.5 0.1% ,  7.0 0.4% ,  7.5 1.2% ,  8.0 4.0% ,  8.5 11% ,  9.0 28%

So at pH 9, the same level of ammonia will be a factor of 280 times (28% divided by 0.1%) more toxic than at pH 6.5.

Reply from a retailer: As a retailer of fish for the past 6 years, I have always told my customers to acclimate their fish. I really became convinced of the need for acclimation several years ago after I moved fish from a large holding pond to a sale tank. I had not checked the ph to see if it was the same in both ponds. I shortly had fish going belly up from pH shock. I have had nothing but good results from telling my customers to acclimate their fish. I can see your point about large quantities of fish being transported for long periods of time, but I am interested (as x is) in what you think about acclimating fish that have only been bagged for a short period of time. Also, would your advice be the same if the fish were being transported in hauling tanks instead of bags?

Well, now you’ve read it. What do you think? Have questions? Why not bring them up at the next meeting. Interesting stuff huh!